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grammar question

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rdavison
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grammar question

Postby rdavison » October 19th, 2007 5:06 am

I want to know how I would construct a sentence like "I wanted to go with you". I was thinking it could be 君と行くの欲しかった (kimi to iku no hoshikatta), but there's also -tai as in 君といきたかった (kimi to ikitakatta). Which would be correct? I know that -no can be used to nominalize clauses (right?), but when I was looking at the different translations it would make, they wouldn't line up with the english I wanted. Are there other particles that deal with clauses?

Also, how would I say:
"I hope to...."
"I hope that...."
"The car that I saw at the train station came this way."
"I don't have anything to say" (I was thinking 言い物 はありません but I doubt that's even real japanese)
"One time, ...."
"Another time, ..."
"My first time, ...."
"My second time, ..."
"My seventh time, ... "

I know that 初めて exists for first time (right?) but I don't know how to say for the rest.

Thank you!

Shaydwyrm
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Joined: July 15th, 2007 11:22 pm

Re: grammar question

Postby Shaydwyrm » October 19th, 2007 6:26 am

rdavison wrote:君といきたかった

This is fine, although in many cases you would leave out 君, making it just 行きたかった. 一緒に行きたかった (いっしょにいきたかった) is more natural if you want to emphasize the "with you" part. You don't need any clauses or anything since "I wanted to go" is just one (conjugated) verb in Japanese.

"I hope to...."
"I hope that...."

I asked someone this the other day, and they suggested 「そうなるよう願います」. I have no real experience with this construction though.

"The car that I saw at the train station came this way."

駅で見た車がこちらへ来た。
えきでみたくるまがこちらへきた。

"I don't have anything to say" (I was thinking 言い物 はありません but I doubt that's even real japanese)

I think 何も言うことはありません。(なにもいうことはありません。) is okay for this. 物 generally refers to tangible objects.

"One time, ...."
"Another time, ..."
"My first time, ...."
"My second time, ..."
"My seventh time, ... "

I know that 初めて exists for first time (right?) but I don't know how to say for the rest.

一回目
二回目
三回目
etc.
二回 means "twice", as in "I did it twice". 目 tacked on the end gives the sequential sense.

In general though, it's going to be tricky learning Japanese by taking English and trying to convert it. There aren't always exact equivalents, and you will end up with rather unnatural sounding Japanese. 気をつけてください!

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rdavison
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Joined: October 7th, 2007 6:09 am

Postby rdavison » October 19th, 2007 7:07 am

So in the example:
駅で見た車がこちらへ来た。
えきでみたくるまがこちらへきた。
It's perfectly fine to stick a verb in the middle of a sentence like that? Since the verbs come at the end, I figured that there would have to be some particle that did the job of allowing a verb (not the main verb) come in the middle.

--

I totally forgot about 一緒に thanks for that one.

--

The one about mono vs. koto sounds right. I knew there was something wrong with saying "iimono" but I couldn't figure out what it was. Tabemono, kaimono, and nomimono all refer to things, and even just the word mono means things, but I guess it's for tangible items. Hopefully, someone will completely confirm it, but for now it makes sense to use koto (which in itself means something like "thing" or "about" right?).

--

As for 一回目 and all the others, thank you very much. I have no idea how to pronounce these though. Furigana is a magical thing, definitely, haha.

--

Maybe someone can clarify the "hope" sentences?

--

Thanks so much for responding, I wasn't expecting something so detailed.

Shaydwyrm
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Posts: 117
Joined: July 15th, 2007 11:22 pm

Postby Shaydwyrm » October 19th, 2007 4:41 pm

Sorry, 一回目 is いっかいめ、then 二回目 にかいめ etc. Works just like other counters.

As for sticking verbs in the middle of a sentence, the verb is actually modifying the noun. For how this works , you should look it up in a grammar guide somewhere :-) I'm sure it comes up in the beginner's lessons here somewhere as well.

jkeyz15
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Postby jkeyz15 » November 22nd, 2007 4:29 am

rdavison wrote:So in the example:
駅で見た車がこちらへ来た。
えきでみたくるまがこちらへきた。
It's perfectly fine to stick a verb in the middle of a sentence like that? Since the verbs come at the end, I figured that there would have to be some particle that did the job of allowing a verb (not the main verb) come in the middle.

Think of it like this
駅で見たがこちらへ来た。
red = adjective
blue = noun described by adjective

evita
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Postby evita » November 25th, 2007 7:34 am

In Japanese, there's no real difference between "I hope to" and "I want to." It's both the verb ends with たい. If you're looking for a more formal way to say want to, people often say "I think I want to." So 〜〜たいと思いす. For example, 日本に行きたいと思います. Literally, it means "I think I want to go to Japan," but the speaker knows that they want to go; it's just more polite that way.
For "I hope that..." people usually say "It would be nice if...." For example, 晴れればいいね. (wouldn't it be nice if the sun came out). Or when people kind of pray for things they say "so that~~will happen" (〜〜様に). For example when people pray at temples to become rich they'll say お金持ちになる増す様に. There you can also say you want something/someone to do something by using verb+て欲しい. For example, 静かにして欲しい (I want them to be quiet). All those change the phrase a lot, but I think the meaning is the same. Did that answer your question?
For "I have nothing to say," it sounds best as 言う事がありません。Or if you're using informal, 言う事ない。何も言う事はありません isn't wrong, but it doesn't feel very natural.

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