Is memorizing all the 漢字 readings worth the time?

[jbiesnecker]

皆さん、初めまして。私は畢ジョンです。どうぞ宜しくお願いします！

I'm new to Japanese and JapanesePod 101, and I have a question for the Big Brain: is it worth the time and effort to learn the various readings of the 漢字 (as opposed to just learning how they're pronounced in various words)?

I ask this because I've spent the last four or so years learning Chinese, and I can read somewhere around 3000 characters (in Chinese), so I've already done a lot of the "heavy lifting" of learning characters, but I'm just now learning how they're pronounced and used in Japanese.

Learning the pronunciations of the characters in Chinese is pretty simple (the vast majority of characters only have one pronunciation, and those with multiple pronunciations seldom have more than two), but Japanese is quite a bit different in this regard. Is it worth learning the 19 or something readings for 生, or should I just learn how to pronounce the words in which the characters are contained?

どうもありがとうございます！

[Bucko]

Just learn the pronunciations in context, so every time you learn a new word with 生, learn that particular pronunciation. Don't learn all 19 pronunciations of 生 at once! However, I recommended trying to remember whether a particular pronunciation is onyomi or kunyomi. This will mean that you'll be able to read many words phonetically and you'll be able to take a guess as to how to say it.

[bshock]

Naturally I'm going to say that Kanji is worthwhile to learn, since I took the time to do it

However, I can see the possibility of confusion in Japanese if you already learned 3,000 common characters for Chinese. Although onyomi are supposed to be the "Chinese pronunciation," my brief glimpses at Chinese language suggest that the sounds are not very similar these days. As such, this may present an extra challenge in your case.

Perhaps you might take a layered approach to Kanji. Start by focusing on the onyomi of each character. As with Chinese, there are rarely more than two pronunciations. This will allow you to pronounce perhaps 90 of all complex Japanese words, which are usually represented by two Kanji characters.

As you go along, then, you might next memorize just the most common kunyomi form of each character. I apologize for the vagueness of this suggestion; it is not always easy to know what the most common kunyomi is. Knowledge of spoken Japanese might help to guide you in this.

In time, you could memorize the less common kunyomi pronunciations, if you wish.

One way or another, if you try to learn Kanji, you will also have to memorize the pronunciation of each complex word in context. Although most of these words use two onyomi, it is not always clear which onyomi (ex: 不正 is pronounced "fusei," but 正 could be either "sei" or "shou"). Further, onyomi pronunciation can change slightly in combination (ex: 一本 is "ippon" rather than "ichihon"). Of course there are also plenty of situations where kunyomi pronunciations are used instead (ex: 取り引き is "torihiki"); although this can be obvious when words are combined with hiragana, sometimes kunyomi pronunciation does not require this (ex: 取引 may be a more common spelling of "torihiki"). The bottom line is that sometimes you can't figure out the correct pronunciation -- you just have to know it.

[tiroth2]

I vote for learning only in context. Most words have only a couple of common readings. The other ones are frequently idiosyncratic and may only appear in a couple of common words, or perhaps only in one, so it's better to learn that word than to associate the uncommon reading with the kanji.

Also, as a beginner you won't have much intuition for which readings are likely if you open up one of those books with 2000 kanji and 20,000 readings in it, so it's much easier this way.

Congrats on your progress in Chinese, I think you should find reading/writing Japanese a snap with that under your belt.

[WCR91]

This thread sounds like a good place to ask this question:

1) Are Kunyomi readings strictly for when the character is by itself or with some hiragana?

2) Are Onyomi readings only used in compounds? How do you know which On reading goes with what compound?

[tiroth2]

WCR,

There is no way to know for sure. But if you take these guesses, you will be right more often than not:

1. No. But often, there are clues that something is read with kunyomi. For instance, if any part of the compound uses okurigana, then it's probably ALL read with kunyomi. These compounds are typically combinations of words that could otherwise stand alone, unlike a true compound whose consituent parts aren't normally read seperately in the same way that they are used in the compound.

2. Usually. Other than a very few high frequency kanji, there aren't many that have multiple on readings, so it usually isn't necessary to guess which one. When there ARE multiple ones, one usually sounds "better" so you can sometimes guess given enough experience.

[jbiesnecker]

Thanks much, everyone! I think I'm going to follow the prevailing advice and learn the characters' pronunciations in context. I find that I'm able to read almost anything in Japanese and figure out what's going on based on the characters, but I couldn't read outloud (and I miss words in kana that I don't know).

There are some interesting "false friends," though, like 手紙 (which is toilet paper in Chinese), that throw me.

[Tiduas]

jbiesnecker: Even tough it must be a little easier to learn Kanji when you know Chinese already, it must still be a little confusing becuase all the kanjis did just get even more meanings ^_^

And well, both the japanese and chinese make sense. "Hand" and "Paper" do really fit with both Toiletpaper and letter. Sometimes i just love Kanji =D

[Jason]

I vote for learning only in context.

Ditto. Kanji in Japanese is extremely context sensitive. IMO, learning all the readings outside of context isn't very practical or productive.