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Some comments on how bad (and good) Japanese works

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petermerkel505
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Joined: April 29th, 2006 1:10 pm

Some comments on how bad (and good) Japanese works

Postby petermerkel505 » May 1st, 2006 12:00 pm

As for the teaching, when I want to learn something I prefer a University room rather than having a drink with my teacher. When I want fun it is the other way round. If you expect or look for teacher-entertainers I think that teachers-teachers (and entertainers-entertainers, that´s to say, people who respect and is loyal to their own field of expertise) are the best. A good teacher is entertaining too because fun is part of the teaching process and entertainment is never an ingredient added or combined with the teacher to make a “combo” (please, let´s leave making cocktails to the bartenders). Besides, Japanese language is so appealing and wonderful by itself that I feel there is no need to spend time and effort to give any extra.

Those of you working in a company with time to learn only a few pieces of information every day, people who only want a meal and a room in Japan, voracious students without appetite (the true ones never feel close to egomaniacs or aren´t afraid to be taken by one of them, they feel proud to be like that and don´t take precautions when the say it), newcomers (I can´t imagine a more lively and rewarding Japanese learning than doing it speaking and writing to my family but Tohru will have his own reasons to do it that way), manga fans, kids... Japanesepod101 is for all you whithout any doubt and I never said the opposite. I recently spoke about a desirable wider range of topics covered in the lessons and a more eclectic approach to teach Japanese but listeners preferred to call my comments “studying 1300´s Japanese legal system” or “discussing n-manifolds with a waiter”. On the other hand, I never showed any doubt about japanesepod101 credentials to teach japanese, never said that it is not to the point within the narrow limits the staff chose to move, never said that it is not useful to learn conversational Japanese plus some hundreds kanji (more about this next post)… but people felt anyway that they had to remember all this to me. What all this means is too clear to spend time commenting on it. Facts like that (and many others) sets the tone of what´s discussed in the comments section and shows its real (and very low) value as a forum of discussion on what´s done in japanesepod101.

I think podcasts are a great way to teach languages but japanesepod101 doesn´t make use of all the potential advantages it has. The humor, entertainment and liveliness that Peter tries to show in every lesson (very good though occasionally it is overdone) sets at the same time the limits of the podcast because the pressure he puts on himself to be fun and entertaining will make hard for him to take on issues that are taken on in other webs or books that teach languages. This web, for instance, says in its “About us” section that “…Lessons are carefully crafted to include current events, words, celebrities, and so-on. For example, when the Japanese baseball team made it to the finals of the World Baseball Classic, we were able to do a lesson about this on the very same day. Before the Olympics we had a lesson introducing the big name Japanese stars. And of course, we’ll be doing the same for the upcoming World Cup in Germany…” and, leaving aside the English grammar mistakes, when you give three examples of current events and the three of them are about sports it is very clear what you understand by “current events”. One can be lucky if the evolution of Nikei, the latest scientific breakthroughs or the political situation of Japan are mentioned once per year (how did the businessman listener call these three examples? Yeah… I remember now… “…to disucss Fourier Transforms…” (I copied and pasted) and things like that) Culture classes are so few and far between than, in fact, one can´t complaint too much about this. That paragraph doesn´t mention the fact that only advanced Japanese students can find useful to know the kanjis or pronunciation of Japanese Olympics stars names (and we already know that this is not for advanced students), in that particular lesson about the Olympics, no Japanese language item was explained (at least I don´t remember it), no vocabulary related to Olympics was taught systematically (only a bunch of words) , and on and on. How can you say that “Lessons are carefully crafted to include current events” when there is no Japanese lesson, just two people commenting on what they consider current events.

Does this mean that I think Japanesepod is doing it wrong? Not at all. It is enough to see the posts in the forum (Food and eEntertainment 45, History and Tradition 6, General culture, 0) to realize that what Peter is trying to do is totally right. I just mean that Japanesepod101 may work in the future perfectly well as a business by teaching basic Japanese or being the very good survival audio phrasebook for tourists that is now (it has already everything to be successful. Its faithful listeners remember it in every post and I agree with them on this) but it could be much more than that and so far they have hardly showed a true desire to become it. This web could be an excelent platform for people who wants to live Japan (and also live in Japan) and not only survive in it. The pompously called “2.0 version” of this web was a missed opportunity to do it. They failed and I regret it because I truly believe in this idea and, above all, in the people working on it.

Take care all of you

The Frankensteiner
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Postby The Frankensteiner » May 1st, 2006 12:18 pm

You're confusing the heck out of me.
:?

Can you tell me the ultimate point of your post in a concise paragraph please?
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MikeCassidy
Been Around a Bit
Posts: 22
Joined: April 25th, 2006 2:13 pm

University vs. JapanesePod101

Postby MikeCassidy » May 1st, 2006 2:20 pm

Peter Merkel,

I thought of taking [auditing] Japanese again at University but the classes are at 9 A.M. and I am at work by then. The course I took 30 years ago was five days a week 2 hours and 3 labs each an hour. I do not have the time for that anymore; maybe in the next year or two if I retire I'll take a course.

So this for me is a nice alternative; I also use Rosetta Stone and my old text books.
Also, my course was not conversational Japanese; the idea was we could pick that up fast by going to Japan.

There is also a big difference in cost. I went to Columbia and at the moment is $1000; I believe the cost at NYU is close to this.

As for technical vocabulary such as Fourier Transforms, I would not mind learning some computer terms, though I think I could guess at many. However, technical [scientific], business [stocks bonds etc], and legal would be outplace on this board. I do not think many would know what to do with Fourier Transforms in any language. I have not looked aty them in over 30 years and would be able to handle them.

Jason
JapanesePod101.com Team Member
Posts: 969
Joined: April 22nd, 2006 1:38 pm

Postby Jason » May 1st, 2006 3:03 pm

The Frankensteiner wrote:You're confusing the heck out of me.
:?

Can you tell me the ultimate point of your post in a concise paragraph please?

Yes, I have no idea what you're on about either, Merkel. Quite frankly, this and your other post sound like verbose and thinly veiled insults.
Jason
Manager of Mobile & Mac Applications

MikeCassidy
Been Around a Bit
Posts: 22
Joined: April 25th, 2006 2:13 pm

Re: University vs. JapanesePod101

Postby MikeCassidy » May 1st, 2006 4:26 pm

MikeCassidy wrote:Peter Merkel,

I do not think many would know what to do with Fourier Transforms in any language. I have not looked aty them in over 30 years and would be able to handle them.


That should have been I could not handle Fourier Transforms; my math is very rusty.

sutekikanojyo
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Posts: 62
Joined: April 27th, 2006 12:12 am

Sumimasen...

Postby sutekikanojyo » June 11th, 2006 4:17 am

Merkel-san, what on earth are you going on about? This is ridiculous. JP101 is working wonderfully for those who want to use it and do so as they please. If you do not like JP101 for one reason or another, you can find another way to learn Japanese. There is no need to chastise those who are taking their valuable time to bring you a valuable lesson. It's an option, not an obligation. If JP101 fails to meet your standards, find a new place that does.

metablue
Expert on Something
Posts: 249
Joined: April 24th, 2006 5:18 am

Postby metablue » June 11th, 2006 6:39 am

He's gone away, he will not answer.

sutekikanojyo
Established Presence
Posts: 62
Joined: April 27th, 2006 12:12 am

Postby sutekikanojyo » June 11th, 2006 6:30 pm

i am greatly tempted to celebrate, but for the sake of propriety i shall not. ^.~'
*~.SutekiKanojyo.~*

Jason
JapanesePod101.com Team Member
Posts: 969
Joined: April 22nd, 2006 1:38 pm

Postby Jason » June 11th, 2006 10:55 pm

I'd forgotten about this thread. Since he doesn't seem to be coming back, I'll take this opportunity to lock this thread.
Jason
Manager of Mobile & Mac Applications

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